2point2

This is a solution to a common problem with EFs and aggressive clutches. The bigger ACT HD pressure plate for an H22 really puts this pedal assembly to the test. This is the last time I'm digging this POS pedal assembly out form under my dash.


before


after

OEM pencil dick support was cut out in favour of a 1"dia hunk of metal. Did some welding along the seam as well.



1/2" shoulder bolt aka stripper bolt. Will not break or bend.



Quick assembly sketch of how it's put together.


Modified by 2point2 at 6:01 AM 1/22/2007

legendboy

inventor

u using r11? series or pro?

Howitt

that looks like solidworks, I love it but not at 5k a seat

enrike

it's a really good thing
nice job

2point2

Thanks.. It's inventor.. not sure what version.

I cant draw worth **** so I use it to get my ideas down. I can't weld either..

Was thinking of making a few sets.

88_DX

How many clutch pedals have you broken? I havent had any problems in my crx or any other EF ive had?

2point2

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 88_DX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">How many clutch pedals have you broken? I havent had any problems in my crx or any other EF ive had?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Two, and my friend has gone through a couple as well. There is at least 15 threads in the crx/civic section on a search. I've never heard of it happening with a stock clutch.. but when you have a very agressive clutch on a street car it's only a matter of time.

dr_latino999

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2point2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Two, and my friend has gone through a couple as well. There is at least 15 threads in the crx/civic section on a search. I've never heard of it happening with a stock clutch.. but when you have a very agressive clutch on a street car it's only a matter of time. </TD></TR></TABLE> Heh, my first one broke from old age.

2point2

Hey guys, a couple people have asked about this so I decided to make 4 extra sets.

If anyone is interested PM me. I can sell them as a kit so you can weld it in yourself.

RACEPAK

BUMP 4 2.2........

where can i get this inverter? is it a freeware?

sharkytm

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RACEPAK &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">BUMP 4 2.2........

where can i get this inverter? is it a freeware?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Inventor, and no its not free, not even close:
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/s...46282

Andy R

PM Sent

sCeRaXn

Looks good man

I just replaced my pedal bracket this weekend on my 90 crx. That was a major pain in the ***. It took me almost 4hrs to switch them out. I was just gonna weld it back together but it was beyond repair. The bolt itsself didnt break...it sheared the metal on the brake pedal side and the bolt popped out, then the part where the clutch pedal attatched bent all the way to the left(to the floorboard ) and cracked 3/4 of the way up

I had to pay $130 to get the bracket to me($98 if i didnt have it shipped next day). It was $73 from Majestic but they wanted $68 to ship it next day

xci_ed6

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by sCeRaXn &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I had to pay $130 to get the bracket to me($98 if i didnt have it shipped next day). It was $73 from Majestic but they wanted $68 to ship it next day </TD></TR></TABLE>

jesus, i'd car-part.com it, and call someplace south. (then probably modify the replacement)

HT Chaplain

So what did everyone do after it broke?? Did you have to get your car towed?? or could you limp home? or were you stuck on the side of the road??

2point2

sometimes you're able to limp home, the first thing you'll notice is a very spongy feeling from the clutch, and then the grinding going in to gear starts. If you search the ef forums you'll find pictures of the stud sheering right off. You're not going to get very far if that happens.

adding weld to the bracket and stud works but with an aggressive clutch I'm not going to take the chance at breaking a welded (brittle) stud at 100mph+.

The clutch pivot seems like a bad design that was an afterthought after figuring out the automatic setup IMO.

My thinking was that for the time and effort it takes to find and pull a pedal assembly why not modify the OG one with a much stronger design.

hondafiend

or you could just change to the whole hydro pedal and eliminate all that cable actuator nonsense. those never shift right anyway always locked me out of gears. now i have the hydro pedal and no problems!

2point2

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hondafiend &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">or you could just change to the whole hydro pedal and eliminate all that cable actuator nonsense. those never shift right anyway always locked me out of gears. now i have the hydro pedal and no problems!</TD></TR></TABLE>

mind showing some pics of your hydro pedal assembly conversion? you make it sound easy.

hondafiend

i'll try to get some pics soon, its hard to get up in there though! i may be doing another conversion soon so i'll take pics of that one. there are a few ways to do it that i've seen, you can make a bracket to hold the hydro clutch pedal, then mount the master cylinder on top of the pedal and the resevoir where it usually goes on an EG, then run a steel braided line, or you can use a hole saw and make a hole and then drill holes and just bolt the pedal straight to the firewall. either way works. but its pretty tight to get the hole saw in there. i use the bracket method. i'll try to get some pics of it. but its WELL worth it to swap it out. shifts so much better.

HiProfile

Although it looks strong now, I think you could make it even better. Rather than keeping it supported only on one side, why not add a brace to the other side where the cap of the screw is? If the main reason it breaks is because it bends down, then bracing it on both sides like a pig on a rotisserie would easily double its resistance to bending.

I'm hoping to sidestep the issue by just converting completely to hydro, tranny & all. From what I've seen, a prelude slave cyl has the resivoir separate (connected via hose), so you can mount it with some hacking to the cable pedal. Since hydro gets pushed and cable gets pulled (and there's no room in the engine bay there), the cyl is mounted inside, behind the pedal.

2point2

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by HiProfile &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Although it looks strong now, I think you could make it even better. Rather than keeping it supported only on one side, why not add a brace to the other side where the cap of the screw is? If the main reason it breaks is because it bends down, then bracing it on both sides like a pig on a rotisserie would easily double its resistance to bending.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I thought about that; but this way was the most cost/time effective <u>solution</u>. I agree with you with some points though.. the way Honda designed it doesn't make sense and they could have done better.. but I didn't want to spend hours reinventing the wheel with a complicated solution.

I disagree with you about the bolt 'bending'. The root cause IMO is that the bracket separates allowing the bolt to then bend. With the 1" dia hunk of metal between the two it's now impossible for the bracket to seperate.. The larger dia bolt, that is MUCH MUCH stronger (used in tool/die applications) is the extra insurance.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by HiProfile &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm hoping to sidestep the issue by just converting completely to hydro, tranny & all. From what I've seen, a prelude slave cyl has the resivoir separate (connected via hose), so you can mount it with some hacking to the cable pedal. Since hydro gets pushed and cable gets pulled (and there's no room in the engine bay there), the cyl is mounted inside, behind the pedal.</TD></TR></TABLE>

People who know my setup know that I started off with a Prelude master. (it displaces more fluid and I feel it is the proper master to use with an H22 - but that's another debate)

I have pictures of how to install a Prelude master with the OEM CRX/Civic Pedal if you search the EF forums. You can attempt to put in the whole prelude master clutch pedal assembly but get ready to cut your unibody and move your fuse box/wiring. The reason I ditched it is because I was never able to get the geometry right and didnt want to risk my tranny. It was extremely hard to push in the clutch and it felt very unnatural. I also didn't like the mess of wires and cockeyed fusebox under my dashboard. Dicking around under the dashboard trying to weld and troubleshoot is not something I enjoy doing. I wasted so much time and energy converting to a true hydro setup.

The modification I'm showing in this thread is what the final solution to the most annoying problem I've had with my swap (converting to hydro). This is the 'three years later' thread. I finally nailed it.

Keeping the clutch cable (an re enforcing the pedal assembly for good measure!) and a hasport style cable/hydro conversion bracket is the cleanest way to convert to a hydro actuator in my eyes. However, in a race only application where cutting and moving wiring around isn't a big issue it's a different story.

I'd like to see pics of other peoples solutions to converting to a true (and clean) hydro actuator setup on a full interior CRX. When all was said and done, I wasn't able to do it.


Modified by 2point2 at 7:17 AM 1/28/2007

HiProfile

Now that I think of it, it probably was your post I was thinking of. I just remember the pictures were hard to interpret, as any picture under the dash with the dash still there is extremely hard to get right.

When you say the pedal was very stiff, do you think it was because of the angle, or the pivot point? My reasons for going hydro was due to pedal effort. My EF has a stock EG clutch/fw in it, and it feels like a like the heavy-duty pressure plate I had on my b18b1 EG. I'm thinking it may be from an old, worn cable, but all cable setups I've used are stiff, so I doubt it.

Besides hydro conversion, I was thinking about moving the cable mount point on the pedal farther from the fulcrum. Less pedal effort, more ability to control slippage.

2point2

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by HiProfile &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">]Besides hydro conversion, I was thinking about moving the cable mount point on the pedal farther from the fulcrum. Less pedal effort, more ability to control slippage.</TD></TR></TABLE>

when you change the fulcrum you change the displacement.

Smokinsax

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2point2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Was thinking of making a few sets.</TD></TR></TABLE>

If you did, I would deffinately pic this up. Not cause mine is broken (it does creak when pushing in the clutch), but a just in case kind of thing.

89civicdx

Haha welcome to my world lol.

I could pull a motor out quicker than that ******* bracket lol. The first time mine broke I knew i wasn't going to put that crap back in without fixing that.

I just got another bracket and used a long bolt, nylock, and washers. never had a problem after 4 years and ACT HD plate.

Mine would brake on the opposite side of yours though and the whole pedal would flop over to one side like a dead fish.

I don't think i would ever put in any HD plate in my car without touching the bracket as well.


edit: just to add if it brakes on the other side and your pedal flops over ...sometimes you the pedal won't touch the clutch switch anymore ...so if you still have that hooked up your car won't start lol