Paint reaction with Filler?

[jimbo89]

Hello, My dad and I painted my car about a year ago and has been sitting in our shop under a car cover for the last 9 months because I am going to school in Wyoming and have a Subaru I drive while here. When I went home on break about a month ago I noticed where we used filler on the car the paint seemed to have a very light yellow color (car is white). I know it wasn't like this last time I saw it though. I was wondering if it was a reaction between the paint and filler? Or what? I am going to re-spray the whole car when I am done with school, just need to know what we need to do in order for this to not happen again... Thanks!

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[LooKinSo ShiFty]

What kind of paint and filler did you use? Also, did you primer over the filler or.. what was your paint process on the part of the car where the filler is showing through now.

[jimbo89]

That's the one thing I cant remember is what filler we used . But we used all DuPont paint and primers. We did 2 passes with primer and wet sanded. Then we did the base coat, then clear coat. So I dont know how the bondo would show through. That's why I am thinking its a reaction. I guess what I need to know is are there certain fillers I cant use with the DuPont paint?

[christmastree]

as long as the putty was coverered with primer you should have had no paint issues and even if it wasnt, that isnt the isue you would have had. typically the only problem you would have is not covering everything good with the base coat and that would be the only reason it would show through. the only time that i have ever heard of white yellowing is in the case of parts that have gone through a fire. and even then i have yet to see that with my own eyes

[Spawne32]

didnt prep it right, body filler > metal glaze > primer > basecoat > clear coat is pretty much standard procedure. If you didnt metal glaze over the filler it sucked the paint down into it.

[Spawne32]

actually if you really wanna get serious with it, after you primer, use a sealer, i used limco PS25nr griptite sealer on my car.

http://partsplustools.com/pdfs/limco_undercoats.pdf

[christmastree]

Originally Posted by Spawne32

didnt prep it right, body filler > metal glaze > primer > basecoat > clear coat is pretty much standard procedure. If you didnt metal glaze over the filler it sucked the paint down into it.

i believe what you are talking about is shrink back. that only has to do with it shrinking back to what is under the paint, and by that i mean scratches. that has nothing to do with the color being bled through. it simply shows your scrathches in your filler (which would still be covered by the paint). which is why you could glaze coat your primer, however it is not neccessary if you finish down your putty fine enough. i do this every day of my life..... im an autobody technician/painter

[Spawne32]

Originally Posted by christmastree

i believe what you are talking about is shrink back. that only has to do with it shrinking back to what is under the paint, and by that i mean scratches. that has nothing to do with the color being bled through. it simply shows your scrathches in your filler (which would still be covered by the paint). which is why you could glaze coat your primer, however it is not neccessary if you finish down your putty fine enough. i do this every day of my life..... im an autobody technician/painter

bondo/body filler is very porous, and if not prepped properly can absorb the paint that goes on top of it, metal glaze is a finishing product for plastic, much more finely textured and much less porous. Since hes only seeing the yellow spots in the areas he used body filler, and he stated that he used primer on the car and wet sanded, its logical to assume that he didnt use metal glaze on top of the filler thus causing the primer/paint to sink into the porous filler itself.

[Spawne32]

also we really need to know what kinda body filler/primer/paint you used.

[jimbo89]

Originally Posted by Spawne32

didnt prep it right, body filler > metal glaze > primer > basecoat > clear coat is pretty much standard procedure. If you didnt metal glaze over the filler it sucked the paint down into it.

This may sound stupid but, what is metal glaze? Never heard of it, never knew i needed it...
We sprayed the whole car with primer to the point that no bondo or metal was showing. So if we didn't cover spots well enough with the base it would be gray, not yellow, right?

Here is a pic of the car in primer before paint. The yellow is showing up and the drivers side rear quarter, which is obviously completely covered, no yellow...



And this is the car finished, definitely no yellow in the rear quarter... like I said I just noticed it when i went home to visit a few weeks ago..

[Spawne32]

Snap some pictures of the yellow spots when you get a chance, maybe that will give us a better look, metal glaze is a finishing product for using body filler.

http://www.evercoat.com/productDetail.aspx?pID=1

Two-part polyester finishing and blending putty. Includes ZNX-7™ for adhesion to galvanized metal, aluminum, steel, SMC, and O.E.M paint. Extra-thin formula spreads smoothly. Easily fills grind marks, pinholes, uneven surfaces and other MetalWorks® body fillers and glazing putties to enhance their ease of working. Sands easily. Pinhole-free. Helps prevent staining or bleed-through when used under basecoat/clearcoat paint systems. Blue cream hardener included.


typically we use a red cream hardener on the body filler and blue with the metal glaze, that helps with visually seeing where your light with the metal glaze, then we primer with a limco catalyzed primer, and then the sealer. Heres some pics of mine, still in the shop actually.

bodyfiller/metal galze

primer

wetsand

sealer


currently sitting in the sealer right now at the shop, were gona start the actual paint work next week

[Spawne32]

just asked my old man about it to btw (hes got the 35 years of experience) and he said its definitely bleed through, he said you should have used a sealer for sure on top of the primer. He said the only way to fix that is to reshoot it and use a sealer before you shoot.

[red.integra]

Originally Posted by Spawne32

Snap some pictures of the yellow spots when you get a chance, maybe that will give us a better look, metal glaze is a finishing product for using body filler.

http://www.evercoat.com/productDetail.aspx?pID=1

Two-part polyester finishing and blending putty. Includes ZNX-7™ for adhesion to galvanized metal, aluminum, steel, SMC, and O.E.M paint. Extra-thin formula spreads smoothly. Easily fills grind marks, pinholes, uneven surfaces and other MetalWorks® body fillers and glazing putties to enhance their ease of working. Sands easily. Pinhole-free. Helps prevent staining or bleed-through when used under basecoat/clearcoat paint systems. Blue cream hardener included.


typically we use a red cream hardener on the body filler and blue with the metal glaze, that helps with visually seeing where your light with the metal glaze, then we primer with a limco catalyzed primer, and then the sealer. Heres some pics of mine, still in the shop actually.

bodyfiller/metal galze

primer

wetsand

sealer


currently sitting in the sealer right now at the shop, were gona start the actual paint work next week

you should paint that thing NBP, it would look badass.

[Spawne32]

Originally Posted by red.integra

you should paint that thing NBP, it would look badass.

lol it is being painted nighthawk black pearl, i bought a gallon of it along with limco 4100 high solids clear

[red.integra]

oh, and a 5 speed. forgot about that.

[Spawne32]

Originally Posted by red.integra

oh, and a 5 speed. forgot about that.

you sound familiar

[jimbo89]

Thats the crappy part. I am back at school in Laramie Wyoming till I graduate in December. Washington is home and where the car is, I have a POS subaru to drive while I am here... I think I know what I need to do now though, lets see if I have it strait:

1.) sand the paint back down to filler.
2.) Use a metal glaze over the area I sanded down.
3.) Primer and wet sand the primer.
4.) Then a sealer, seems to be my problem....
5.) Then base coat, clear coat.

Thanks for all the info guys! as you can see I am an inexperienced painter. You guys have helped instead of flamed like so many of the other members on this sight.

Oh one more question! I have never had anybody paint a car for me (as in a professional) and I kinda want the car to be almost perfect. Painting my car in the winter in a 40x60 shop with a makeshift paint book isn't ideal for painting. Can you give a ballpark estimate of what it would cost for a reputable place (not maaco) to paint my car, no bodywork?
I think my brother will be home home next weekend so I will ask him to take pictures of the yellow spots and i will post next weekend, hopefully...

[red.integra]

Originally Posted by jimbo89

Thats the crappy part. I am back at school in Laramie Wyoming till I graduate in December. Washington is home and where the car is, I have a POS subaru to drive while I am here... I think I know what I need to do now though, lets see if I have it strait:

1.) sand the paint back down to filler.
2.) Use a metal glaze over the area I sanded down.
3.) Primer and wet sand the primer.
4.) Then a sealer, seems to be my problem....
5.) Then base coat, clear coat.

Thanks for all the info guys! as you can see I am an inexperienced painter. You guys have helped instead of flamed like so many of the other members on this sight.

Oh one more question! I have never had anybody paint a car for me (as in a professional) and I kinda want the car to be almost perfect. Painting my car in the winter in a 40x60 shop with a makeshift paint book isn't ideal for painting. Can you give a ballpark estimate of what it would cost for a reputable place (not maaco) to paint my car, no bodywork?
I think my brother will be home home next weekend so I will ask him to take pictures of the yellow spots and i will post next weekend, hopefully...

i have no idea about the price, but your civic looks nice and clean in those pics. just don't ask anybody for a paint code around here... holy shit its like the end of the world top secret double covert intel.

[Spawne32]

its gona be expensive to pay someone i can tell you that, especially if your using basecoat/clearcoat, you dont need to redo the whole car, just the areas that have bleed through, then you can blend them in since the paint is so new. Theres no other bleed through spots on the areas where you didnt use filler correct? Just make sure you use the same paint etc. for the color match.

[oldassintegra]

Originally Posted by Spawne32

its gona be expensive to pay someone i can tell you that, especially if your using basecoat/clearcoat, you dont need to redo the whole car, just the areas that have bleed through, then you can blend them in since the paint is so new. Theres no other bleed through spots on the areas where you didnt use filler correct? Just make sure you use the same paint etc. for the color match.

how expensive?

[christmastree]

Originally Posted by Spawne32

bondo/body filler is very porous, and if not prepped properly can absorb the paint that goes on top of it, metal glaze is a finishing product for plastic, much more finely textured and much less porous. Since hes only seeing the yellow spots in the areas he used body filler, and he stated that he used primer on the car and wet sanded, its logical to assume that he didnt use metal glaze on top of the filler thus causing the primer/paint to sink into the porous filler itself.

There is absolutely no need for it all you need is a quality putty such as rage.

[Spawne32]

Originally Posted by christmastree

There is absolutely no need for it all you need is a quality putty such as rage.

not familiar with rage

[christmastree]

And even with a cheap putty you shouldn't have problems if used properly

[jimbo89]

Originally Posted by red.integra

i have no idea about the price, but your civic looks nice and clean in those pics. just don't ask anybody for a paint code around here... holy shit its like the end of the world top secret double covert intel.

Ya i was pretty satisfied with my car's exterior until I went home this last break and noticed the stupid discoloration. Oh and just to let you know, the SI interior really nice, which was the main reason for buying the car.

haha I have looked around and it seems that way with the paint codes though, I guess people just don't want anyone to duplicate their car...

While waiting for disappointing yellow spot pictures...
Here are a few more pictures my friend took about 9 months ago during my first break home from school (after paint). and some more primer/makeshift paint booth pics, lol.







And my plan is to mask off the whole car except the roof and the rear quarter section, I will just totally redo those parts so I wont have to blend the paint... but yes those are the only spots that are pleading through...

[Spawne32]

since your gona do it that way, the old man says dont go any heavier then 400 git, you just want to sand the clear, and you dont want to break through the clear, assuming you can do that successfully, he said seal it to be safe since he doesnt know what kinda work was done, and then respray, he said dont sand all the way down because it will look horrible. He said the best sealer you can get is the clear coat, so leave the clear thats on there already intact, try like hell not to go through it when you sand it down again.