michaelprice83

Here's the before (dh-racing) ported head and after (greracing.com) flowtest of my F23 head. I will be taking pics tomorrow. I don't own the head yet, so I'll have to visit it with my camera, but Jim was cool enough to do the work on my head without taking my money, just to test his skills on some Hondas (former Nascar builder, currently doing mitsu and ford/chevy work on the regular). Of course I do plan on owning it soon! He will also be doing an F22a and H22a soon. I have an old thread with pics of the dh-racing work that was less than stellar, though it did produce decent flow numbers. I don't know what the baseline is for an unported F23 but considering its lack of popularity among enthusiasts, the general concensus is that its one of the worst flowing heads out of the box. More than a few of you have bluntly suggested spending my money and efforts on a different project (f22a, h22), but my stubbornness and curiosity have lead me to push forward with the humble F23. Considering what we were starting with here, I'm pretty sure this is a success and a testament to Jim's work. Take a look at the sheet and stay tuned for some nice looking head pics. Comments appreciated.

michaelprice83

here's the sheet........

GhostAccord

Impressive numbers

0.5 & 0.6 inches of lift, are you going that high with your cam?

How much have you spent so far in porting to get your F23 head to flow almost as well as an F22A head?

michaelprice83

how much have i spent? enough, lol. but to anyone who wants a better flowing f23 head. jim has my head digitized with his cnc for easy inexpensive duplication. he's not all about the money like most guys.

GhostAccord

I don't think the F23 CNC will work on the F22B2. I wouldn't mind knowing an approximate cost for him to do the work on mine though.

michaelprice83

i have an f22b head in my garage, perhaps i should drop it off at his shop. so far he has my f23 f22a and h22 heads, the f22a and h22 will be done next. as for price, i'm really not sure what he would need but once he gets these digitized it won't be too bad. i will tell you that he doesn't do his heads in "stages". he told me he won't put a half-worked head out there with his name attatched, and that its either ported or not. can't say enough good things about his attitude and approach. you guys are making me crack up, i must admit, but i hope this thread doesn't get locked too soon.

alterdcreations

what are your plans for the other 2 heads? are you just unsure which one your going to use?

GhostAccord

Looking forward to the pics of the finished product.

integrawow,
Cheers

michaelprice83

definitely doing the F23 build. It should be pretty unique, and my curiosity won't be satisfied until i'm driving it. the other heads I have just acquired because they were great deals, though i did briefly think of doing the G23 first....that will be my next build. Jim will be working on the F22a and H22a soon so we can get something to really showcase his work. i can't wait to see what you guys think of the F23 head pics. I'm leaving soon to go snap some, they'll be up late tonight.

JDogg

how much work did they put into that f23 head??

just for comparison.. my h22 head flowed just over 300cfm with just a valve job from RLZ (also an ex. nascar guy)

GhostAccord

Just a valve job......WoW I find it very hard to believe that you got over 300cfm on an H head with a vavle job. Was it a $900 valve job with oversized valves?

It's cool if that's all they did. I've never seen anyone post +300cfm H22 flow charts very often. Never mind with just a valve job.

2U and RLZ for a super valve job.

michaelprice83

yeah, that's one crazy valve job! my head was port matched to h23 runners, valve job with +1 manley pro flow valves. though the entry port shares the same oval size as the h22 and h23 on the inside, the bowl area is smaller which should contribute to some nice velocity. i'll have jim get the exact cc for my stock h22 and ported f23 ports.

2fastGSR

Not too many people post flow charts but yes i'd say that brad is the man to do if it were true.

You should see what s2k heads flow with just a Valve job.

So what cams are you planning to use with this combo?
Our all out race K series cams are barely 600, the largest H series cam I have seen is the .537 roller rockers by crane. Just curious as most people are so focused on the overal CFM number, but at a lift in which the motor will never see.
Not saying this is so with your build, just inquiring. . .

Combustion Contraption

Honda guys crave that 300cfm number like it really really means something. Just like how every street guy wants 200whp.

GhostAccord, you find it very hard to believe that RLZ can get 300cfm out of a head that has 2mm bigger valves on the inlet side than a b-series with just a VJ?

GhostAccord

It's not that I don't beleive 300 CFM is acheiveavle with a VJ. It's more like I don't know if 300CFM with an H head is really a benifit if it's that easy to reach? It makes me wonder why more people aren't using the H heads if it is already configured for numbers like that with just a VJ. But like you said cfm isn't everything and bigger isn't always better. I know from reading your posts that there is a lot more to a head than just CFM....

mar778c

iTrader: (1)

C'mon now, you know 300 cfm@28" of water and 0.5" of lift is significant in terms of power potential.

Combustion Contraption

Marc778c, I cant tell if youre being serious or sarcastic.

GhostAccord, you're correct. There is more to a head than raw CFM. But you're argument is that since 300cfm is easy to reach with 35mm valves, it must not be a huge benefit? That doesnt make any sense to me. Any time you increase the airflow through the cylinder head you increase the max potential HP. I recently got an HT member, theres a thread about it, 336cfm @ .550" w/ a +.5 OS valve'd H22 head. It did 324 @ .500" for the "your cam doesnt go to .550" crowd.

michaelprice83

I just wanted to make it clear that I'm not as obsessed with 300cfm as it may seem, just that in this case 300cfm is pretty unusual for an F23. I will probably be getting a cam in the .400-.450 lift range which, even at that lift, the head is flowing really really well. I don't think the numbers are lacking at any lift with this head, and again small ports mean its not just flowing because it was "hogged". I know there shouldn't be overemphasis on port size but these are a lot smaller than what you seen on an F22 or H22 head, the fact that they flow as well as a mildly ported version of either implies velocity is high.

michaelprice83

pics coming very shortly, blurry, i didn't take them........blame jim......

GhostAccord

I don't proclaim to be a guru of port flow or volumetric efficiency but 300CFM feeding an engine that doesn't require 300cfm/cylinde is a waste, is it not?

Ah the creator doesn't want to let the cat out of hte bag eh!

michaelprice83

doesn't require? is there a requirement that needs to be met but not exceeded? now i'm confused. b16's and b18's sometimes flow 300cfm ???

4g hatch

im sure some head porters can get a b head to flow that,but you would really sacrifice any low end power. it would take a big race cam and 11,000 rpms to take advantage of it.
the h and f heads that flow alot at high lift seem to flow good at lower lifts also,like the one cc did a while back. dont get caught up on peak numbers,just concentrate on where you can use it

MAX_CFM

sorry here is a better pic

Combustion Contraption

Piano-Moving Head Porter

Combustion Contraption

According to our friend, there is such a thing as too much CFM for a given combo.