Ricey McRicerton

After my Koni sport/Ground Control install (which I'm working on a writeup for as we speak) I had to get the car aligned. I noticed some pretty hard toe wear on my front passenger side tire (the inside 1-1.5 inches noticeably more worn than the remainder of the tire). I show up at Merchants, tell them that I want the toe set to 0. They pull the rattletrap Civic up on the lift and the guy doing the alignment tells me that the tie rod ends are trashed.

Tie rod ends are what are going to help keep your toe settings. If they're torn up, the tire wobbles while the car is moving, effectively keeping your toe out of whack the entire time you're rolling down the road.

Tools you need:
17mm socket/ratchet
19mm combination wrench
Pliers for removing a cotter pin
Hammer or some other way to knock the tie rod end loose

How To:
Crack the lug nuts loose. Once the car's up in the air, you've got no resistance on them.

Jack up the car and put it on jack stands. I was doing both front tie rod ends, so I used the jack point under the front of the car and put jackstands under either tab behind the front wheels.

Once the car is up in the air, remove the lugs and pull the tire off. Still no pictures to this point. You can figure this out.


Grab a 19mm wrench and get to the lock nut at the inside edge of the outside tie rod end. I had left my wrenches at my dads place, so I'm stuck using this thing.



*IMPORTANT* YOU WANT TO TURN THE NUT LIKE YOU'RE TIGHTENING IT. THIS IS THE HARDEST PART OF DOING THIS JOB. IF YOU LOOSEN THE NUT, IT JUST MAKES THE TIE ROD END HARDER TO GET OFF *IMPORTANT*




Next you need to remove the cotter pin from the castle nut on the bottom of the outside tie rod end near the steering knuckle. My replacements came with new ones, just make sure you don't throw them down where you'll drive over them.





Next get a 17mm socket or wrench and remove that castle nut.




Once that nut is gone, you'll need to pop the end of the tie rod end out of the knuckle. You can either use a hammer and tap the end up, or you can use a tie rod end seperator (aka a pickle fork) to bust it out. Mine just came out by hand.




Next you'll want to start unthreading the tie rod end. Lefty loosey. It should come right off. If not, it has some flat spots you can use a wrench on to start it coming off. Mine has some corrosion inside, so make sure you oil it before putting the new one on.



Again, half my tools are still at my dads place, so I'm using this instead of my normal Tri-flow stuff.




Tie rod end out of it's old home. Make sure you clean up as much of the rust as you can. It's just going to cause headaches down the road.





Old vs. New



Deflection on the old peice under minor pressure:



Next to no deflection on the new peice under minor pressure:




To reinstall: Reverse the steps you took to pull it out!
Oil the threads you're screwing the tie rod end onto.
Thread it down to about the same place as the old one.
Put the end in the steering knuckle
Put the castle nut on
Put the cotter pin through it
Tighten the locknut down

What it should look like once you're done:




Much better than before!

Make sure you take the car to be alinged afterwards. Even if you eyeball it and get it close to where it was before, it's not going to be perfect.

Modified by Ricey McRicerton at 9:36 AM 6/30/2008


Modified by Ricey McRicerton at 9:38 AM 6/30/2008

Ricey McRicerton

Crap, re-hosting the photos. Where do most of you guys use?

pdiggitydogg

Photobucket for me

Ricey McRicerton

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by pdiggitydogg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Photobucket for me</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks man.

Looks like I know who I've got to use for the suspension install pictures.

blaze the chemi

I take it you can order the replacement as one part from Honda? Or is it a series of different part #'s? THanks for a new DIY.

Did you notice any squeaking or clanging in your suspension (especially oat lower speeds) prior to you replacing the tie rod?

Juan_Mitosis

GREAT FAQ! Loved it. Now. . . how can you tell if you need to replace tie rod ends? How did you diagnose it?

Ricey McRicerton

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blaze the chemi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I take it you can order the replacement as one part from Honda? Or is it a series of different part #'s? THanks for a new DIY.

Did you notice any squeaking or clanging in your suspension (especially oat lower speeds) prior to you replacing the tie rod?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Basically the steering feels very sloppy. I got both outer ends from Advance Auto for 22 bucks a piece. There was no noticeable noise from these. They won't pop like a blown CV joint as far as I know.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Juan_Mitosis &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">GREAT FAQ! Loved it. Now. . . how can you tell if you need to replace tie rod ends? How did you diagnose it?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Jack the car up in the air (of course, jackstands and all that). Sit facing the front of the car and try to move the wheel in either direction (side to side) with the wheel locked. If the wheel moves around, they're probably shot. I don't know if this explination makes sense or not.

Looking at the front of the car:
&lt;&lt; [ V ] &gt;&gt;

Arrows on the outside indicate direction to try and move the tire and the V indicates the tread on the tire.

Luserkid

Damn Sean, i wondered what happened to you. Good to see your still getting dirty

sde780

Nice tutorial, do I need to torque anything down?

Ricey McRicerton

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Luserkid &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Damn Sean, i wondered what happened to you. Good to see your still getting dirty </TD></TR></TABLE>

I honestly don't do that much at all any more. This was all just because the stock stuff was so beat. I broke 185k on the Civic and still drive it day in and day out.

RB_EJ8

Did you turn the wrench up or down?

Ricey McRicerton

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RB_EJ8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

*IMPORTANT* YOU WANT TO TURN THE NUT LIKE YOU'RE TIGHTENING IT. THIS IS THE HARDEST PART OF DOING THIS JOB. IF YOU LOOSEN THE NUT, IT JUST MAKES THE TIE ROD END HARDER TO GET OFF *IMPORTANT*

Did you turn the wrench up or down? </TD></TR></TABLE>

Turn the nut clockwise. Per the picture if you start with the wrench (on the drivers side) upwards, you'll want to push it down twoards the rear of the car.

RB_EJ8

Thanks bro, I just got the tie rod end off

Ricey McRicerton

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RB_EJ8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks bro, I just got the tie rod end off </TD></TR></TABLE>

No problem! Glad it helped. I fought with mine for like 10 minutes before I realized that I was turning it the wrong way.

Mingo

iTrader: (1)

good write up

skcivic4life

when you say to losten the nut turn it like your tightening it? does that mean if im doing the passenger side to turn towards the front?
its not a reverse thread correct? your just saying that as if you were looking at it?
i would agree that i need to turn towards the front but i just wanted to check, i look at the nut from the engine side and it needs to turn towards the front to losten. is that all that is trying to be said?
wow hopefully that mumbo jumby made any sence?

project-boosteD

is there a write up to do the inner tie rods?

xunsungheroesx

Fantastic write-up.

Correct me if I'm wrong but you really only needed to replace the lower ball joint and not the whole tie rod end. Did you replace both because there wasn't a big difference in price or for some other reason?

99_EM_one

nice stuff!

Ricey McRicerton

Ease mostly. I didn't want to have to dick with pressing the ball joints out. These were like 30 bucks a peice and if it saved me a half hour of not having to do it, I was good with it.

Davus

I have my car on jack stands now, with wheel turned. I'm trying a 19 mm on the lock nut, but it seems to be larger. Perhaps a 21?

I may just get the crescent wrench like OP.
But yes, the castle nut will be 17 mm.
I'm replacing my steering rack currently by the way.

(E: Also I'm going to overkill the lubrication with speed, class, and amsoil. Mostly amsoil.)


Edit 2: Also, you guys using any particular brand? I'm planning to just AutoZone/O'Reilly some up, can't wait for shipping on this (need car by Friday ;D).


Edit 3: vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv Duly noted. Now that it's daytime, I'll hit up an auto parts store. My driver side ball joint is ripped it seems.


Modified by Davus at 5:17 PM 9/30/2008

instructor74

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Davus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
(E: Also I'm going to overkill the lubrication with speed, class, and amsoil. Mostly amsoil.)


Edit 2: Also, you guys using any particular brand? I'm planning to just AutoZone/O'Reilly some up, can't wait for shipping on this (need car by Friday ;D).


Modified by Davus at 4:01 AM 9/30/2008</TD></TR></TABLE>

First I really like to use anti sieze on the threads insted of oil never had one get stuck yet.

2nd Get the parts from whoever you want just make sure to spend a few bucks extra for the life time warrenty ones. the amount of abuse these things are under its worth not having to pay for them again

Davus

Reporting back. Only have passenger one due to store only having that one. It's $4 cheaper than driver side one, odd.
Anyway, my passenger side tie rod DOES have a 19mm nut holding the lock in place. I suppose my tie rods were replaced by previous owner at one point or another, and they just used a larger nut. Gonna get a replacement soon I'm sure.

Anyway, light tap of hammer is all it takes to get it out of the wheel-side assembly, luckily. The angle is the main killer, I'm unsure off hand where my wheel lock key is, so I'm just doing this with wheels on (not hard). It's just in the middle of "comes out with hand" and "is stuck". I'll be sure to scrub for rust later.

My tie rod's ball joint had the same hideous amount of play as in the OP post, new one does not move. Yay, new cotter pin, the driver side one was difficult to get out (after-market as well probably) and ended up breaking a few places.

I'm semi-showered, left a lot of mess on me since I'll be right back out there. I suppose when this is all done (steering rack, tie rod ends, etc.) I'll put some crappy Craigslist "free section" 13's on the front wheels and get to an alignment shop. I suppose it won't be too hard to find a high-grade (10.9+?) nut that'll fit my tie rods and be 19mm, but I could be way mistaken. (My dealership usually doesn't stock things like this.)

Anyway, I've had the experience now. Any questions guys?

Another edit: I looked up my weird mismatched nut, just a 14 millimeter thread, so I'll see if I can hardware-store a 14mm thread 19mm head nut when I get my other tie rod end. I dislike having different sized wrenches used for each item in a pair.

Good info, redline.
vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv



Modified by Davus at 5:29 AM 10/1/2008

redline870

first to diagnose a bad tie rod jack the car up, simply grab the wheel at the 9 o'clock and 3 o'clock positions and shake the wheel back and forth. you will be able to feel play in the tie rod, as if its clunking while you shake. look through the wheel if possible and check if you can see any play while shaking the wheel. honda tie rods do not go bad very often let me tell you. i work at a shop that does tons of tie rods and alignments and i think i have seen only 2 bad honda tie rods in my whole time working there. if you are taking the steering knuckle off for any reason and dont want to damage the tie rod then take a hammer and smack the area right next to where the tie rods seats. there is actually a little nipple that sticks out on the tie rod perch and that is where you are supposed to hit it. a few good hits and the tie rod should pop right out. do not hit the tie rod from the bottom because you will damage the threads. also never use never anti-seize or oil on the tapered part of the tie rod directly above the threads. only where it threads on to the inner tie rod.

2sLoJR

Good thread, planning on busting this job this week.