95 Accord Legend 2 Piston Brake Upgrade

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sick!!!!!!!

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sick!!!!!!!

[MestizoRacer310]

OK, so would I run into any problems if I put them w/ the bleeder screws on top so I don't have to remove the calipers from the spindle every time I'd need to bleed/flush the system?

Also to reiterate...calipers in question are from ANY 93 and up COUPE and 94-95 GS (coupe AND sedan)?

[MestizoRacer310]

Originally Posted by TouringAccord

...I've only heard of people flipping the right caliper to the left side and left to right to get the bleeder screw on top. But then I always wondered if that hurt any performance of the caliper, since you would now be using it in reverse of how it was intended to be used on the Legend. You would now be contacting with the bigger piston first instead of the smaller one or visa-versa, can't remember which piston is first when mounted correctly in a Legend.

Autozone just called me to tell me my legend 2piston calipers have been delivered. I'm going to do this next week in school. I need to know for sure which is the best way to mount them....flipped around so the bleeder's on top OR correct side but bleed them off the car...????

Also what brake pads are good for street use/light canyon runs....and if I should get stainless steel braided brake lines while I've got the system opened...

Hell, I'll just probably upgrade the lines in two weeks...and re-bleed. HAHA I need the hours at school.

[dvp95]

Hey which ones did you buy from autozone and how much were they? I was thinking of buying them since its so hard to find at a junkyard.

[DCFIVER]

using the legend calipers is not the best option
http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=836
You're better off going with Prelude VTEC calipers. They also use 11" rotors. Also if you do not increase the size of the MC's pistons you will not be utilizing the full benefit of this upgrade.

[MestizoRacer310]

Originally Posted by cb7-R

You're better off going with Prelude VTEC calipers. They also use 11" rotors. Also if you do not increase the size of the MC's pistons you will not be utilizing the full benefit of this upgrade.

Getting the MC is part of my plan. I went to a parts place and looked at the MC of my accord and the MC of a '95 legend GS side by side. The bolt pattern matched to bolt the MC to the brake booster and the lines that go to the calipers are correct. I did notice that the way the reservoir would sit looks crooked. Is there, or would that be cause for concern? If the cap's on correctly I really don't think it would matter, it would just take a tad more time making sure it's at the correct level, but it could also mess with the brake light (for when the level is too low...)

Any thoughts on that?

[Bruce Banner]

looks gewd

[BoostedH23Accord]

Maybe I missed it but what was the cost of this upgrade.

[MestizoRacer310]

Originally Posted by BoostedH23Accord

Maybe I missed it but what was the cost of this upgrade.

I paid approx. $110 each (reman. w/ pads each side) $220 plus CA tax at Autozone
Then I'm looking at about $150 at ASC (downtown los angeles) for a 1" master cylinder then another $100 to $160 for stainless steel braided brake lines. Debating what brand to get. There's Earl's for 100, then there's Goodridge for $163.99 then Russel's for 169.99.

I know the benefits of going w/ stainless braided lines but don't know what the differences are between brands....???

[DCFIVER]

Originally Posted by MestizoRacer310

Getting the MC is part of my plan. I went to a parts place and looked at the MC of my accord and the MC of a '95 legend GS side by side. The bolt pattern matched to bolt the MC to the brake booster and the lines that go to the calipers are correct. I did notice that the way the reservoir would sit looks crooked. Is there, or would that be cause for concern? If the cap's on correctly I really don't think it would matter, it would just take a tad more time making sure it's at the correct level, but it could also mess with the brake light (for when the level is too low...)

Any thoughts on that?

Yes but you have to remember that as you increase the size of the pistons you will also need to increase the force needed to assist in pushing those pistons out. By which i mean you will also need a larger booster. Also the required push rod length is not the same between the two masters another reason you will need a bigger booster. One of the reasons the GS's stopping power is so great is the amount force clamping down on the rotors even when you barely tap the brakes. In order to achieve this same force you would have to slam on your brakes with your stock set up.

[NoSmoking]

I found this over in the prelude forum:


"After reading that first thread, I am lead to believe that installing the Legend calipers will lead to a decrease in lower stopping force:

Quote, originally posted by Kotetu »
Here's an example, with 600PSI exerted through the BMC:
P=600 psi
cF=.33

Rotors:
D1=11inches
D2=10.5inches

Force on rotor = (Pressure*piston Area) * (brakepad Coefficient of Friction) * (2 pads)

Braking torque = fR * (radius-1)/12inches per foot

Stopping force (on tire) = bT / ((wheel radius)/12inches per foot)

Force on Rotors (pounds):
fR1=(600*3.976)*(.33)*(2)=1574.5 //front brake with stock (prelude VTEC) caliper
fR1a=(600*3.905)*(.33)*(2)=1546.38 //front brake with twin piston caliper
fR2=(600*1.4)*(.33)*(2)=554.4 //rear brake

Braking Torque (foot-pounds):
bT1 = 1574.5 * (11/2-1)/12=590.5 //front brake with stock caliper
bT1a = 1546.38 * (11/2-1)/12=579.8925 //front brake with twin piston caliper
bT2 = 554.4 * (10.5/2-1)/12=196 //rear brake

Stopping Force (pounds):
sF1=590.5/((20/2)/12)=708.5 //front brake with stock caliper
sF1a=579.8925 / ((20/2)/12) = 695.871 //front brake with twin piston caliper
sF2=196/((20/2)/12)=235.6 //rear brake




So the Legend/NSX brakes are actually a downgrade???"

In view of this the only advantage I can see to the GS 2 pot is that it spreads the force over the pad more efficiently and makes the pad "address" the rotor more effectively, making the real difference in brake torque impossible to predict with simple math. Need to compare two identical vehicles with both setups. NosmoKing

[NoSmoking]

I just put prelude vtec calipers and rotors on my accord. Hard to imagine any stock setup would perform better

[jmk2888]

Originally Posted by cb7-R..no more

using the legend calipers is not the best option
http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=836
You're better off going with Prelude VTEC calipers. They also use 11" rotors. Also if you do not increase the size of the MC's pistons you will not be utilizing the full benefit of this upgrade.

I have a 1994 Accord EX Automatic, which year Prelude Vtec rotors should I buy ? Do I need larger rotors or would my stock be fine ?




Modified by jmk2888 at 10:36 PM 2/27/2008

[JuNkDoGAccOrD]

Originally Posted by NoSmoking

I just put prelude vtec calipers and rotors on my accord. Hard to imagine any stock setup would perform better

for the lude vtec calipers what caliper brackets did you use ?

[NoSmoking]

23T

[NoSmoking]

You have to do a rotor over hub conversion to use Vtec rotors.

[JuNkDoGAccOrD]

Originally Posted by cb7-R..no more

Yes but you have to remember that as you increase the size of the pistons you will also need to increase the force needed to assist in pushing those pistons out. By which i mean you will also need a larger booster. Also the required push rod length is not the same between the two masters another reason you will need a bigger booster. One of the reasons the GS's stopping power is so great is the amount force clamping down on the rotors even when you barely tap the brakes. In order to achieve this same force you would have to slam on your brakes with your stock set up.

so does the brake booster from the legend bolt up in the CD location ?????

Originally Posted by NoSmoking

You have to do a rotor over hub conversion to use Vtec rotors.

did you upgrade your Master cylinder ???

[NoSmoking]

Have an EX Near as I can tell has the same MC as prelude. LOL looked for Legend calipers for a month and ended up buying two sets, accidently, on the same day. Tried to cancel one because the other was cheaper and was sent already.

[Cannon Slirpa]

nice job

[2mchbst]

Originally Posted by NoSmoking

I found this over in the prelude forum:


"After reading that first thread, I am lead to believe that installing the Legend calipers will lead to a decrease in lower stopping force:

Quote, originally posted by Kotetu »
Here's an example, with 600PSI exerted through the BMC:
P=600 psi
cF=.33

Rotors:
D1=11inches
D2=10.5inches

Force on rotor = (Pressure*piston Area) * (brakepad Coefficient of Friction) * (2 pads)

Braking torque = fR * (radius-1)/12inches per foot

Stopping force (on tire) = bT / ((wheel radius)/12inches per foot)

Force on Rotors (pounds):
fR1=(600*3.976)*(.33)*(2)=1574.5 //front brake with stock (prelude VTEC) caliper
fR1a=(600*3.905)*(.33)*(2)=1546.38 //front brake with twin piston caliper
fR2=(600*1.4)*(.33)*(2)=554.4 //rear brake

Braking Torque (foot-pounds):
bT1 = 1574.5 * (11/2-1)/12=590.5 //front brake with stock caliper
bT1a = 1546.38 * (11/2-1)/12=579.8925 //front brake with twin piston caliper
bT2 = 554.4 * (10.5/2-1)/12=196 //rear brake

Stopping Force (pounds):
sF1=590.5/((20/2)/12)=708.5 //front brake with stock caliper
sF1a=579.8925 / ((20/2)/12) = 695.871 //front brake with twin piston caliper
sF2=196/((20/2)/12)=235.6 //rear brake




So the Legend/NSX brakes are actually a downgrade???"

In view of this the only advantage I can see to the GS 2 pot is that it spreads the force over the pad more efficiently and makes the pad "address" the rotor more effectively, making the real difference in brake torque impossible to predict with simple math. Need to compare two identical vehicles with both setups. NosmoKing

whats thd difference in a 94 accord ex caliper and a 93-01 prelude vtec caliper? and is the prelude caliper worth swapping for better stoping?

[bseriescrxsi]

Originally Posted by gianinline

so, what would be the special tool for this job?

pepboys sellss a nice little slide hammer kit that i believe comes with a similar part to that